Gesualdo

[ardcarp]

I expect several Choir folk will have listened to Building a Library, which was one of those dialogue-overview affairs.

I wonder if anyone shares my thought that the Madrigali need to be delivered with a certain amount of Italianate passion and expressiveness? Two of the available performing groups have countertenors on top and both seem to produce rather tame, precious accounts. It is generally thought that Gesualdo would have used female singers (3 Ladies of Ferrara, and all that) and for me the only group that came close was The Consort of Musicke.

Books 4 and 5 do get quite tricky, and I wonder if some of our well-known recording choirs have been unwilling to dip their toes in the water?

[ostuni]

Well, I'd hope 'our well-known recording choirs' continue to steer clear: this is one-to-a-part music, surely?

You mention groups with countertenors on top - but I'm not sure what you're thinking of here. La Venexiana, with sopranos on top, have plenty of Italianate passion & expressiveness (I'm a great admirer of both Emma & Evelyn, but I do think that Italian-born singers bring something extra here). And the Hilliards may often perform with a countertenor on top, but for the recent 5th Book recording, they bring in a soprano (Monica Mauch, who's sung with them in a number of projects) and an extra countertenor for the top 2 parts.

Which two 'tame precious' accounts were you thinking of?

[ardcarp]

'our well-known recording choirs' continue to steer clear: this is one-to-a-part music, surely?

No firm evidence that OVPP is obligatory. Anyway, Exaudi (mainly OVPP) have spent a lot of time doing the Gesualdo madrigals, including a BBC Stephen Johnson talking about music programme, but (as far as I know) they haven't committed them to disc. I'd like to hear The Sixteen (even if only eight of them!) having a crck at some.

Which two 'tame precious' accounts were you thinking of?

Well, I was thinking of Hilliards and Delitiae Musicae.

I sort of agree with your point about Italian-born singers maybe having the edge, but we're in tricky waters here. Do French choirs sing, for instance, Poulenc better than anyone else? But I didn't object to TK's final choice, Venexiana. Yes, they were expressive to a point. Maybe I have this gut feeling that Gesualdo should be a bit OTT whether OVPP or not! I was not hasppy with the way she 'dissed' Rooley's lot though. Saying 'it is outdated' means we all have to be slavish followers of fashion.

[gurnemanz]

I sort of agree with your point about Italian-born singers maybe having the edge, but we're in tricky waters here. Do French choirs sing, for instance, Poulenc better than anyone else? But I didn't object to TK's final choice, Venexiana. Yes, they were expressive to a point. Maybe I have this gut feeling that Gesualdo should be a bit OTT whether OVPP or not! I was not hasppy with the way she 'dissed' Rooley's lot though. Saying 'it is outdated' means we all have to be slavish followers of fashion.

It might depend whether your own experience of the language is up to detecting anything unidiomatic. For me it seems to apply to the intimate vocal forms much more than in opera. I do know German and in Lieder even slight discrepancies from non-native speaker interpreters can be bothersome on repeated hearing.

[ostuni]

Yes, I'm not terribly convinced by Delitiae Musicae's downward transpositions (though I've only heard their Monteverdi, and only heard the second half of TK's survey: need to catch the rest on iPlayer). But, as I said above, the Hilliards dont have a countertenor on the top line! (Well they do for the Tenebrae at the end of the programme, but that's different...).

Native singers - yes, that's a biggie! 25 years ago, British professional vocal ensembles were singing straighter, and more in tune than their continental counterparts. (Big generalization! But a kernel of truth there, I think...). Is that still the case?

[ardcarp]

I think several ensembles in France and Italy 'learnt from' (if that's not too conceited) UK choirs...indeed some even used UK singers. I think the UK still scores in terms of very good amateur choirs of which there don't seem to be that many on the near continent...but my experience may be outdated and I stand to be corrected. I think the Scandinavian/Baltic traditions have always been strong, and some of their very good choirs over there don't need any lessons from us...though I notice the odd UK choir trainer pops up over there from time to time.