"Happy clappers" counterblast: J. Duchen on "how to be a nice audience"

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

He may well have "expected it", but that does not suggest that in any way he liked it.

[vinteuil]

He may well have "expected it", but that does not suggest that in any way he liked it.

... whereas Alpie knows what we should do

[french frank]

Which, hopefully, will be never! How insulting to assume that Tchaikovsky did not expect just such an outbreak of approbation at that very point.

Well, it could OTOH be insulting to assume that he did expect it.

This must be a bit of a problem for those who can't abide stick-in-the-mud tradition. Where do you run when the applause becomes a tradition?

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Where do you run when the applause becomes a tradition?

Maybe you stay at home and listen to studio-made CDs. That would be a pity, and not great for the employment prospects of classical musicians.

[JohnSkelton]

Well, it could OTOH be insulting to assume that he did expect it.

This must be a bit of a problem for those who can't abide stick-in-the-mud tradition. Where do you run when the applause becomes a tradition?

A practice of not applauding during performances (with the exception of certain styles of opera) gradually developed following a practice of applauding during performances of music (not necessarily when there was a break in terms of a symphonic movement etc.). It's probably correct to say the development runs parallel to certain developments in classical music (the basic reference in the concert hall still seems to be later C19 early C20) and in the social arrangements surrounding the performance of that music. Perhaps one problem has to do with practice becoming tradition - perhaps what will happen (assuming everyone doesn't give up through a mixture of infuriation at other people and mind-numbed boredom) is that other kinds of practice will in turn develop that at least feel more 'natural' to more people.

Purely personally I wouldn't put inter-movement applause as all that much of an irritant though I wouldn't do it myself, and I can easily block out someone briefly whispering to someone during a performance, etc. I find more difficult people getting terribly annoyed about applause / disruption and making a point of it by shushing. I agree there's something a bit formulaic about some of the inter-movement applause - just another place where people think they ought to clap. But if it's spontaneous excitement / enthusiasm I find it easy enough to switch back on again (though appreciate others feel differently). Perhaps the worst thing for classical music enthusiasts would be if everyone other than the diehards, the connoisseurs, the people who know their Klemperer from their Karajan and can give you the date of each of their recordings of the Eroica stop going to classical concerts.

[3rd Viennese School]

Point no.4

I will probably be surveying the Hospital Drains before going straight to the Proms!

Hope this helps.

3VS

[Flosshilde]

Well, it could OTOH be insulting to assume that he did expect it.

This must be a bit of a problem for those who can't abide stick-in-the-mud tradition. Where do you run when the applause becomes a tradition?

As I asked a bit back, when did the custom of applauding between movements die out? We are now simply seeing (or hearing) a return to a previous tradition or custom.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

We are now simply seeing (or hearing) a return to a previous tradition or custom.

You could use that argument to justify anything - capital punishment, the stocks, fox-hunting, trial by ordeal, feudalism, slavery, (even harpsichords ).

[Flay]

I feel sure that Tchaik intended there to be applause after the 3rd movement of the Pathétique: triumph then pathos. Wiki tells me that Patetičeskaja means "passionate" or "emotional," not pathetic.

Generally I would prefer silence in between movements, and for the conductor to indicate this by arms raised for longer than necessary, perhaps with courteous comments in the programmes.

I hate the clapping after operatic arias, while the music is continuing. One of life's torments.

[prokkyshosty]

As I asked a bit back, when did the custom of applauding between movements die out? We are now simply seeing (or hearing) a return to a previous tradition or custom.

Somewhere around the beginning of the last century according to Alex Ross:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2010...use-rule-obama

'In the first decades of the 20th century, mid-symphonic applause was still routine. When Elgar's First Symphony had its first London performance, the composer was called out after the first movement. Around 1900, though, a group of German musicians and critics began promoting a code of silence, à la Bayreuth. Hermann Abendroth was among the pioneers: in Lübeck, where he led concerts from 1905 to 1911, he told his audience not to clap between movements. By the 1920s, several leading conductors were discouraging excess applause. At first, many listeners resisted, regarding this as a display of arrogance on the part of superstar maestros. Olin Downes, chief critic of the New York Times, campaigned against the Rule in the 30s and 40s. After describing how Koussevitzky had gestured disapprovingly toward his audience when they clapped after the third movement of the Pathétique, Downes exclaimed: "How anti-musical it is! Snobbism in excelsis!"'