Sunday Morning

[Ein Heldenleben]

That doesn't affect my argument. The argument was that that was the BBC aim, not that it was the (successful) result. Many R2 listeners won't have moved over to R3, and many R3 listeners will have given up listening. If you have another explanation as to why the BBC moved an R2 programme over to R3 rather than just dropping it if it wasn't felt to fit Nu-R2, I'd be interested to hear it. You may have privileged information: the BBC normally keeps individual programme figures secret - unless they can be presented as a huge success when they are widely publicised.



Yes, that would mean many R2 listeners lost out, but the discussion is about R3. What is the BBC up to? How does it see R3 developing?

By “that argument” I also mean the idea that putting that show in the slot is a ratings winner . I don’t think that’s the reason and I’m pretty sure the powers that be don’t either . ThIngs just aren’t that neat,
I’ve no idea why it was resurrected on Radio 3 but knowing a bit about human and especially producer psychology and the pseudo science of ratings analysis it’s most likely that the new controller just liked the programme and wanted to bring it back, The problem about this forum is that people either see conspiracies or “strategic” decisions everywhere and just don’t allow for that fact that sometimes people just commission what they like.

[french frank]

... but why the fig should these things invade the tiny space available for classical music? Why the fig are they on radio 3 in the first place?? Why do we have to 'give way' to products for which there is apparently no room on their original, appropriate, channels - the Light Programme, Radio 2???

Because no one at the BBC (at least with any influence) is capable of grasping any difference between a birthday tribute to Juie Andrews and a broadcast of a Haydn string quartet or a Beethoven symphony other than by how many members of the public will enjoy listening. So slink away JS Bach et al. Not wanted on the voyage.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Because no one at the BBC (at least with any influence) is capable of grasping any difference between a birthday tribute to Juie Andrews and a broadcast of a Haydn string quartet or a Beethoven symphony other than by how many members of the public will enjoy listening. So slink away JS Bach et al. Not wanted on the voyage.

Of course they can grasp the difference . They are not stupid and nor are they so transactional . They just think there’s room on the channel for a lot of Bach and Haydn and the very occasional tribute to an outstanding British light musical talent and I heartily agree with them. It’s only once every 90 years.

[vinteuil]

It’s only once every 90 years.

... "would that it were, would that it were... "

.

[vinteuil]

British light musical talent ...

... your own words.

You don't answer the question.

If there is no room for 'light music' on the 'light music' channel, you don't explain why it shd impose itself on this particular channel, where this is little enough room left for what we used to call 'classical' music



.

[Ein Heldenleben]

... your own words.

You don't answer the question.

If there is no room for 'light music' on the 'light music' channel, you don't explain why it shd impose itself on this particular channel, where this is little enough room left for what we used to call 'classical' music



.

Julie Andrews has been on Radio 3 many times. Not least a major interview with Edward Seckerson on Stage and Screen back in 2003 . Light music has always featured on Radio 3 . I used to work on a drive time show Matinee Musicale and then Mainly For Pleasure back in the 80’s which featured it. I reckon at least 23 hours of 24 on Radio 3 is classical music. It’s not being squeezed out. The problem is that it’s all a bit sliced up…

This singling out of Julie Andrews is beginning to sound ungracious.

[french frank]

the very occasional tribute to an outstanding British light musical talent and I heartily agree with them. It’s only once every 90 years.

It gave you particular pleasure to listen to it. Is that the only justification for it being on R3? Why wasn't thatt a good enough reason for it to be on R2? Let's be honest: this isn't about one single programme that was broadcast on R3, is it? It's about the gradual diminution of unadulterated classical music programmes, without the enhancement of birdsong, and equally chirpy presenters and light music, pop, folk, jazz and anything else producers want to throw into the mix. You'd think the BBC was short of radio airtime.

I disagree with you on one point: I don't think the higher echelons of the BBC have a clue about classical music. Unlike the man who initiiated the Third Programme who saw no problem in serving a small audience.

[vinteuil]

Mainly For Pleasure.

... my father always said that the rot set in with Richard Baker and the whole concept of 'personalities' in the foreground on radio 3

[Ein Heldenleben]

It gave you particular pleasure to listen to it. Is that the only justification for it being on R3? Why wasn't thatt a good enough reason for it to be on R2? Let's be honest: this isn't about one single programme that was broadcast on R3, is it? It's about the gradual diminution of unadulterated classical music programmes, without the enhancement of birdsong, and equally chirpy presenters and light music, pop, folk, jazz and anything else producers want to throw into the mix. You'd think the BBC was short of radio airtime.

I disagree with you on one point: I don't think the higher echelons of the BBC have a clue about classical music. Unlike the man who initiiated the Third Programme who saw no problem in serving a small audience.

On a factual note it is still the case that Radio 3 broadcasts much more classical music than any other genre and that it broadcasts more classical music in absolute terms than it did in the sixties , seventies , eighties and nineties - thanks largely to Through The Night. The justification for it being on Radio 3 is that the channel has always featured high quality lighter music and in particular has featured Julie Andrews before.

[Ein Heldenleben]

... my father always said that the rot set in with Richard Baker and the whole concept of 'personalities' in the foreground on radio 3

What personalities like Hans Keller ?

[vinteuil]

What personalities like Hans Keller ?

... he had something to say : he wasn't a 'personality' or 'celebrity'. Unlike the Richard Bakers of this world - the sort of people who became 'famous for being famous'.

I'm sure you can tell the difference...

.

[LMcD]

... but why the fig should these things invade the tiny space available for classical music? Why the fig are they on radio 3 in the first place?? Why do we have to 'give way' to products for which there is apparently no room on their original, appropriate, channels - the Light Programme, Radio 2???



.

Well, whoever's in charge of Radio 4 is unlikely to help out, as it seems to have enough self-confidence to continue to deliver a mix of current affairs, drama, documentaries and comedy and sees no need to 'refresh' its offer. I haven't listened to Radio 3 Unwind, but can't imagine that it has much to offer former Radio 2 listeners. Perhaps somebody thinks that the advantage of moving programmes onto Radio 3 is that this will annoy fewer people.

[vinteuil]

Perhaps somebody thinks that the advantage of moving programmes onto Radio 3 is that this will annoy fewer people.

(all too plausible...)

[Ein Heldenleben]

... he had something to say : he wasn't a 'personality' or 'celebrity'. Unlike the Richard Bakers of this world - the sort of people who became 'famous for being famous'.

I'm sure you can tell the difference...

.

Hans Keller was a personality in a way that Richard B wasn’t . He was the archetypal bland BBC presenter surely ? If you mean he had no talent other than presenting why not say it.

[french frank]

On a factual note it is still the case that Radio 3 broadcasts much more classical music than any other genre

On a factual note most of it is served up as unenlightening presenter-led snippets. A single Schubert Impromptu followed by Bernard Herrmann's Vertigo... And in the sixties, seventies, eighties and nineties the BBC had fewer 24-hour radio stations. I don't count presenter-led snippets as unadulterated classical music.

thanks largely to Through The Night.

There you have it - an unsocial hours programme which you can access later on BBC Sounds. Not a radio station as it once was.

The justification for it being on Radio 3 is that the channel has always featured high quality lighter music and in particular has featured Julie Andrews before.

To repeat: it's not about one single programme about Julie Andrews. If that was all it was,, I predict there'd be little outcry. And you don't address the question of why it wasn't on Radio 2 in the first place rather than Radio 3.