The Leader of the Concerto Party

[antongould]

My thanks to salymap for alerting me to an article in the new BBC Classical Mag on the wonderfully weird Mr. Gould. The article not surprisingly mentions the famous occasion in 1962 when Glenn decided the way he wished to play the opening movement of the Brahms Piano Concerto No.1 which was in a manner at complete variance with the vires of the conductor Mr Bernstein. It was played in the "stately manner" the soloist wished but only after LB had made a witty and charming speech dissociating himself from the interpretation. He also suggested that usually the most the soloist could achieve was a "score draw" with the conductor but that the latter had usually a strong upper hand.

As a novice this fascinates me - who usually takes the lead on a concerto and/or who should?

Was this just an isolated incident when Gould used his cult status to feed his probably overblown ego?

[Alf-Prufrock]

Well, I have heard this recording and there seems nothing bizarre to me. Bernstein either went along with a perfectly reasonable interpretation or Gould modified his ways.

[rauschwerk]

In an ideal world, conductor and soloist have enough rehearsal time (or have done the piece enough times together) to arrive at consensus. Otherwise, it is generally regarded as the conductor's job to accompany the soloist. Alfred Brendel (can't find chapter and verse) has stated that older conductors are less willing to do this, and that in such cases, "the soloist might just as well make up his mind to accompany the orchestra". He cites Boult as a notable exception to this rule.

Conductors who are good accompanists (Previn is one) don't get much credit outside the profession, and stories of awkward ones abound: Sargent taking the finale of Concierto di Aranjuez so fast that the young Julian Bream simply couldn't keep up, then patronising Bream in a speech to the orchestra; Klemperer being unable or unwilling to accompany Dennis Brain when recording the Hindemith concerto. In his later years (as I recall from Charles Reid's biography) Barbirolli used to complain about having to conduct so many concertos.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Unless the soloist and conductor can come to a sensible agreement, there is little purpose in performances going ahead, other than for the concert fee. Some conductors clearly have their own agenda and need to be in charge at all costs. On the other hand there are soloists who think it's perfectly OK to be unpredictable in performance, blaming the conductor and orchestra when things being to go pear-shaped.

[Ventilhorn]

Unless the soloist and conductor can come to a sensible agreement, there is little purpose in performances going ahead, other than for the concert fee. Some conductors clearly have their own agenda and need to be in charge at all costs. On the other hand there are soloists who think it's perfectly OK to be unpredictable in performance, blaming the conductor and orchestra when things being to go pear-shaped.

As a young "apprentice" James Louchran proved to be a very aware and sensitive accompanist.
Nobody was better for me than Charles Groves, who only had to hear the soloists cadenzas once and could put the orchestra back in right on the button every time. He even managed with Malcuzinsky that both soloist and orchestra should finish at the same time - a notable achievement.

Beecham was not good with concerto solists which was surprising in view of his achievements in Opera. I don't believe he was particularly interested in concertos with orchestra and included very few in his programmes.

The worst conductor/accompanist by far that I encountered was Silvestri. Ask Peter Katin!

Good morning all. Six days to countdown.

VH

[salymap]

Of course I accept the truth of the story about Sargent and Bream but MS was often requested by earlier soloists recording concertos. Off hand, Schnabel, Clifford Curzon, Solomon and others were pleased to record with him. Schnabel recorded all the Beethoven piano concertos with him in, I believe,, the 1930s. Apart from the piano, Heifitz and Tortelier worked well with him

[rauschwerk]

Yes, salymap, you are indeed right about Sargent. Perhaps he tried to get one over on Bream because he was young?

I have been trying in vain to find Eugene Ormandy relating an amusing anecdote about his first gig with Rachmaninov (the piece being the Paganini Rhapsody) in which the composer had a serious memory lapse.

[antongould]

Unless the soloist and conductor can come to a sensible agreement, there is little purpose in performances going ahead, other than for the concert fee. Some conductors clearly have their own agenda and need to be in charge at all costs. On the other hand there are soloists who think it's perfectly OK to be unpredictable in performance, blaming the conductor and orchestra when things being to go pear-shaped.

It could have been a solution in 1962 I suppose, in fact some of the audience possibly worried it had happened when LB appeared to make his little speech.
He starts by assuring the audience that Gould, who sometimes failed to show, had actually turned up!