That Old Feeling

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

..watching Great Day in Harlem ... very moistened peepers ... [practically all passed is why] great dvd score it if you can .... it is the great photo call



but the striking comment was Bud Freeman's "In 100 years they will be listening to Pee Wee more than Benny Goodman ....

well in less than 60 i already do .... he is something else, never mind the technique was there a more expressive clarinettist ..?

[Serial_Apologist]

..watching Great Day in Harlem ... very moistened peepers ... [practically all passed is why] great dvd score it if you can .... it is the great photo call



but the striking comment was Bud Freeman's "In 100 years they will be listening to Pee Wee more than Benny Goodman ....

well in less than 60 i already do .... he is something else, never mind the technique was there a more expressive clarinettist ..?

Many would agree... Lol Coxhill, for one.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

Stuff Smith got an honourable mention or two ....

[Ian Thumwood]

Calum

Intrigued to read Bud Freeman's comments about Benny Goodman and not really at all surprised. There is a brilliant book called "Voices of the jazz age" by the unlikely named Chip Deffaa that profiles Freeman and revealed (at least for me) the most incredible misperception about any jazz musician I have read. By all accounts, there was more to Freeman's playing than allegedly re-hashing his solo on "The Eel" and he was someone who was very savvy with what was happening in more modern forms of jazz. At one stage he begged to study with Lennie Tristano but the pianist was reluctant to take him on as he was aware that his teaching would compromise he unique style.

The reason why the quote is not surprising is that Bud Freeman spent an unhappy period in the late 30's as a soloist in Goodman's band and it would appear that there was no love lost between the two of them. This ensured that Freeman was forever reluctant to work in any big bands after this experience. In light of this, you can appreciate that there was a degree of hostility towards Goodman and perhaps the remark was not made for musical reasons?

I must admit that I like both Russell and Goodman as well as other clarinetists of that period who made some terrific jazz on this instrument. From a technical point of view, Goodman left most of his contemporaries standing but it is clear that whilst Goodman, Russell and Freeman all came from the Austin high School / Chicargo scene, Goodman was the most conversative in his taste and the least likely to be impressed with any "supposed modernism." What I find interesting is that there are probably few oeuvres in jazz more forgotten than the kind of music played by these white Chicargoans. Most fans will appreciate Jack Teagarden but players like Jimmy mcPartland, Frank Teschmacher, etc are largely missing from 21st Century consciousness. Whilst many fans can rattle off the likes of Ellington, Henderson, Armstrong, Morton and Oliver, their counterparts in Chicargo have largely seen their reputations crash. Eddie Condon is now considered more his his drinking than his recorded legacy - I don't recall any thread being dedicated to him on these boards. Even the Muggsy Spanier Ragtimers records which were revered when I first discovered jazz in the early 80's are seldom mentioned. Few musicians have declined in reputation as the "king of Swing" (unfairly in my opinion) but I think his Chicargo colleagues have probably only been more poorly served by the passage of time by the White New York players such as Miff mole and Red Nichols. Both groups of musicians are hugely unfashionable these days but perhaps it is time for a re-appraisal.

I think you have to be careful reading comments such as Freeman's as there is a separate agenda which is not apparent some 60-odd years later. Read the Chip Deffaa book if you can get a copy as this offers some fascinating insights into some pretty obscure musicians and players like Jabbo Smith who should have been much better known.

[Alyn_Shipton]

Ian
Nice to think that someone has read Chip's book, which my company published in conjunction with Illinois University Press in the 80s. We also published Bud Freeman's 3rd volume of autobiography, and probably his most comprehensive, "Crazeology" which you might enjoy. Bud was living in London for a while in the late 70s / early 80s. I played with him a few times and spent many afternoons with him in John Kendall's basement at Dobell's record shop in London. He was a fount of knowledge (although he preferred to chat to me about Oxford and Shakespeare, being an obsessive anglophile). The thing is, despite all that you say above, every tune I ever played with him threatened to (and often did) turn into the Eel. I'm not sure I agree with you about the Chicagoans - they seem to me to have done all right. Wild Bill was over here a lot in the 80s, and their music gets a regular series of outings on JRR. The Nichols / Mole NY players are less respected and well known, though Jazz Oracle have just issue a mega set of Nichols reissues.