serialist jazz

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

review by Fordham

whirlwind records festival at Kings Place

Whirlwind is the label started by bassist Michael Janisch

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Interesting how the drums keep a sense of continuity, here. Do we prefer this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qg6f9jbLd4

to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s11zaVuqzlE

?

[Serial_Apologist]

Interesting how the drums keep a sense of continuity, here. Do we prefer this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qg6f9jbLd4

to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s11zaVuqzlE

?

Hmm. I preferred the second, but it may be that the first of those two clips conditioned my listening to hearing a piece in 4/4 with passing modulations into other meters.

This Fordham grauniad article link seems to work:

http://www.theguardian.com/music/2013/sep/26/john-ogallagher-anton-webern-project-review

[Serial_Apologist]

Not actually a serial piece in this blast from the past - as far as I know, sadly the only surviving clip of a band that once won a GLAA award of the year:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gw1ZAn_U-dM

A straight transcription from what my ears tell me.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

thanks for putting the link up S_A

[Alyn_Shipton]

Nothing new about serialism in jazz - Franz Koglmann has been exploring this for years. Doesn't seem to have made it to Youtube yet, but you ann hear samples of the Pipetet here: http://www.allmusic.com/album/schlaf...e-mw0000123054

[Quarky]

Stockhausen may be a more fruitful source of serialism for Jazz. From my limited knowledge of serialism, Stockhausen's version is more accessible than that of the original Second Viennese school. I believe Stockhausen may have played in a Jazz band at some stage:

"His influence was also felt in the world of progressive jazz. Miles Davis, whose later albums make extensive use of studio techniques, paid homage to Stockhausen’s influence in his works. In his autobiography, he wrote that “I had always written in a circular way and through Stockhausen I could see that I didn’t want to ever play again from eight bars to eight bars, because I never end songs: they just keep going on. Through Stockhausen I understood music as a process of elimination and addition.” The collage-like quality of music from the ‘Electric Miles’ period was said to stem directly from his reaction to Hymnen and several of Stockhausen’s non-electronic pieces.
Throughout the ’70s, a string of artists including Brian Eno, Pink Floyd and Frank Zappa would acknowledge Stockhausen’s influence on their increasingly innovative work. By this time, of course, the liberation of electronic music was well under way; the increasing availability of commercial synthesizers and advanced recording equipment helped to deliver electronic musical creativity to a much wider constituency — who wasted no time in taking it in more readily accessible directions."

From http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar0...tockhausen.htm

Wild guess: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V53-7RlbbLo ?????????????

[Richard Barrett]

The mention of "serial jazz" immediately brought to my mind the name of the Dutch composer/arranger Tom Dissevelt, who was making jazz-inflected electronic music at the beginning of the 1960s, like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwFSJJwT8_o - he also wrote 12-tone jazz charts in the late 1950s, some of which are currently in the process of being reconstructed from the parts so they can be played again.

Some of Stockhausen's music shows very clearly the extent to which his harmonic thinking was affected by his experiences as a jazz pianist and his liking for the voicings and sonorities of 1940s big-band music, as you can hear especially in the orchestral piece Inori from 1974 but not only there.

But that Sound On Sound article is quite inaccurate in many ways...

[Serial_Apologist]

The mention of "serial jazz" immediately brought to my mind the name of the Dutch composer/arranger Tom Dissevelt, who was making jazz-inflected electronic music at the beginning of the 1960s, like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwFSJJwT8_o

Tom's name is completely new to me, so many thanks for posting this, Richard.

[Quarky]

Interesting how the drums keep a sense of continuity, here. Do we prefer this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qg6f9jbLd4

to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s11zaVuqzlE

?

We prefer both. Were both pieces scored, or was there some degree of improvisation?

Interesting Monday's Jon3, where a strictly scored minimalist type piece was praised highly by Jezz and an NY critic.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

We prefer both. Were both pieces scored, or was there some degree of improvisation?

They're the same piece - but in the first, the drummer added a "plug-in" throughout (presumably to help the non-professional players keep time). It sometimes irritates me, sometimes makes me smile - but I find it also makes me hear the Music more "tonally" than the original.

[Quarky]

whirlwind records festival at Kings Place

Whirlwind is the label started by bassist Michael Janisch

I gather John O Gallagher has written a book on 12 tone improvisation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBYziHLcNJ8

Might be useful for learning about serialism?

Not yer conventional Jazz musician!

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I gather John O Gallagher has written a book on 12 tone improvisation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBYziHLcNJ8

Might be useful for learning about serialism?

Not yer conventional Jazz musician!

(Isn't a "conventional Jazz Musician" one who has rather missed the point?)

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

(Isn't a "conventional Jazz Musician" one who has rather missed the point?)

nah just plays in the Stan Kenton Orchestra .........................