David Murray Quartet : Saxophone masterclass @ Turner Sims

[Ian Thumwood]

For anyone living in Hampshire, the Turner Sim's concerts are something of a godsend when it comes to hearing quality, world-class jazz and this has historically been a venue for some of the best gigs in Southampton for since about 1987 and after the marketing fiasco of the George Russell orchestra gig at the old Mountbatten Theatre which was so poorly publicised it made the Evening Echo. Over the last few years some of the more recent names have been featured and perhaps given an impression that the European / UK scene doesn't quite match up to more important artists from the US such as Steve Coleman.

In this month, the situation has been rectified by Gwilym Simcock's Anglo-American band and last week by David Murray's latest quartet. I would have to admit to not being a devotee to Murray's music - I've seen him on four previous occasions and sometimes been impressed whilst on others I've been a bit bored by the bravado. His big bands have never really appealed, for example and I think that he is an artist who has worked with musicians who aren't quite of the same stature. David Murray has been a musician I felt that I should have liked but he has never been a favourite. Thursday night was something else, however.

The band consisted of Jaribu Shahid on bass, Rod Williams on piano and the legendary Nasheet Waits on drums (wearig the kind of jumper that looked like he had escaped from the set of "Star Trek.") I'm not sure how this band ranks in terms of his other groups (the mixing was a bit muddy sometimes) but the leader was in imperious form. Sometimes the band didn't sound quite as tight as other groups I have heard (compare with Branford's quartet with Tain's atomic precision) but it provided the perfect spring-board for the tenor solos. The key to the success of this concert was was truly catchy and infectious tunes played by a band who seemed to be taking directions on the spot as opposed to performing charts. This ensured that the music was totally spontaneous and exciting. On top of that, David Murray produced some of the most passionate and cohesive tenor I've heard in a long time. To my ears, this performance suggested that it has taken over the mantle from Sonny Rollins with an ability to conjure solos that are logical whilst being very outside some times. I was also struck at just how much he was taking his cures from players like Herschal Evans and Ben Webster - one of the highlights of the big was a duet with the bassist whereby they performed Dukes' "Solitude." The best moment was a tune dedicated to a baseball team where David Murray switched to bass clarinet. This was sensational.

Although Williams had his moments on piano, I think this concert was primarily an exercise for Murray to front a rhythm section with one of the very greatest drummers in the business in his line up .You could argue that Waits has been more "outside" whilst performing with the wonderful Tarus Mateen but I think as a platform for a soloist to launch in to the stratosphere, this groups did all that was necessary. I don't think anyone could have complained that the encore featured Murray as the only soloist. This was a gig where the leader has no agenda or point to prove and yet demonstrated that he would have slayed any competition that this country would have presented. This was "Real jazz" and for those on this board who have lauded some of the local talent on this board recently, ample prove that when measured up against a titanic figure like David Murray, the likes of the girl featured on last week's JLU are merely tinkering with the music. Murray produced a performance that coupled unboundless exploration with a knowledge and appreciation of the music's history that singles this concert out as one of the highlights of 2103. After a gig like that, it is impossible not to be converted. The next DM album needs to be a Duke Ellington album. In summary, this concert was so good that it would have even made Bluesnik burn his Barney Willen LP's.

Odd not to have seen any reviews of this quartet's gigs. Mr Shipton.......?

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

David Murray/David Burrell..."In Concert". Victo CD016. (Canada 1991).

Breathtaking duo date. It will change your narrow life.

NO more from me.

BN.

[Ian Thumwood]

David Murray/David Burrell..."In Concert". Victo CD016. (Canada 1991).

It will change your narrow life.

NO more from me.

BN.

????

[Serial_Apologist]

For me the "real" Murray remained the 1976 Archie Shepp follower who I reckon went on to give Jan Kopinsky (Pinsky Zoo) an idea or two from his work on Blood Ulmer's "Are You Glad To Be In America"; I argued with Charles Fox - for whom Murray's Coleman Hawkins recreations were a youthful reminder of a different kind of tenor playing - and left the Murray trio gig at the Bath Festival in around 1990. Murray was coasting - he hardly bothered to show of what he was capable, and indeed only did so when he appeared at a pub in Bristol (for which entrants had to pay 20 quid - I refused to go) and according to witnesses coasted until joined for two last numbers by Andy Sheppard, who "just happened" to be in the audience. Of the original WSQ he's the one who lost my favour.

[Ian Thumwood]

S-A

That's quite an interesting story and perhaps indicative of the era. Curiously, I've heard a very similar story regarding Sheppard and a jam session in this neck of the woods albeit this centred upon Sheppard's reluctance to play with local musicians. Because of the heritage of the tenor sax, there is very much a combative aspect with this instrument and I suppose that where is probably more politics associated with it than any other instrument. Another story I was told many years ago was that a local player had challenged Scott Hamilton as the American was considered "old hat" and rather an easy target to be taken on in such a battle. I think this effect was also exacerbated by the fact that Hamilton is a really strange character and maybe was seen as something of a soft target. I was informed that the local saxophonist was asked by Hamilton what tune he wanted to play and when he responded with a title like "Cherokee", Hamilton is supposed to have responded what key did he want to play it in. The local musican then realised he had bitten off more than he could chew and was taken apart. From Murray's point of view, having to spar with AS must have been pretty tedious.

Funnily enough, I have heard your criticism levelled at Murray before but if you are playing in a pub in Bristol are you effectively going to pull out all the stops? I'm not overstruck by Sheppard even if he seems a perfect fit in Carla Bley's bands where I have heard him perform out of his skin. He seems a good player but not in the same class as Murray or at least to the degree I saw him last week. I would also add that I don't think DM is in anyway unique in sometimes coasting - Oscar Peterson made a whole career of it. As I said, I've heard him previously and the last quartet he fronted with Lafayette Gilchrist and Cassandra Wilson wasn't bad. Before this, I've seen the octet back in the late 80's and this was probably a case of the music being too advanced for my taste. In addition, I've seen him front two big bands and neither ensemble really impressed - a latin-tinged orchestra that played in Vienne was stuffed full of some pretty obscure names from around Europe and involved a lot of bravado and postering which has made it diffiicult for me to appreciate his music in the past.

As for the WSQ, I like the work of his companions although I don't really like saxophone quartets. Thankfully, they aren't quite as in vogue as they were in the 1980's. "The Wire" once did a blindfold test with John Harle that included a WSQ track and he was extremely critical of their intonation and timing - something that intrigued me as being the opinion of someone from the Classical divide and perhaps a "put up job" by the journalists in that magazine who always seemed to have an agenda as to what was "hip" and what wasn't. (A British jazz pianist with a famous Mum once described these journalists as a "bunch of w****rs" as they seemed to hold sway over the reputation of jazz musicians. From recollection, Murray was always a favourite of this publication even though as a young adult this seemed very bewildering as his music rarely got airplay on programmes like JRR or "Best of jazz" and the CD's never seemed to be available in the record shops unlike the ECM stuff that I was hugely in to at the time. I suppose that some of my lack of interest in his music was attributable to "The Wire" repeatedly banging on about his records.

As I've grown older I think someone like Murray becomes more problematic. In the 1980's, Garbarek seemed hugely influential but, looking back, it's players like Brecker, Joe Henderson, Lovano and Leibman who set the agenda for that decade. I think Murray probably deserves to be put in the same bracket even if he probably has not been as consistant as the others either on record or in person. It's strange that you suggest Murray was coasting. This is something I tend to feel about a number of the identi-kit tenor players around these days. in 2013, there are players like Chris Potter or James Carter (to pick two extremes) who can give Murray a run for his money yet few other tenor players have been quite able to capture the whole gamut of the tenor tradition as David Murray. Until last Thursday, I would probably have been ambivalent yet when you play close attention to what he is doing I'm afraid that his performance of "Solitude", for example, had more "music" within it in ten minutes than you might get from some of the more fancied British names.

I will also have to be honest and say that David Murray gets the "thumbs" up for me largely because he seems not to be ashamed of the music's heritage. In some respects he is as "on message" as Wynton however the results are far more successful when he is at it best. I am not that aware of his work to comment as to whether his earlier work represented his best performances even if I think he sometimes tend to surround himself with musicians who are not of his stature. Where I would concur is your implication that he divides opinion.

[Serial_Apologist]

Interesting post, Ian, because it probably singles out our differences about a lot of things. To start with, I'm not at all sure it's a question of "being, or not being ashamed of the whole tradition". It's certainly one way of looking at one's niche as a creative jazz musician seeking to have an identity, and for me confounded a lot of the jazz sired by Wynton's views from the mid-80s to at least the late 90s here and in America, especially, for complex economic and political reasons. From where my favourites are or have been standing "the whole tradition" is focussed on the point at which the music is progressing, and doesn't need to be going back to make sure all the i's are dotted and t's crossed; but I guess you'd expect me, as a good Schoenbergian, to say that!

Oh and btw Andy Sheppard was a very different player back then - Murray was well and truly out-cut, by all accounts, and had to come up with some goods.

[Ian Thumwood]

S-A

I don't think you can really compare Murray and Marsalis. The latter's music frequently sounds like it could have been produced in the 1050's (especially the Ellington inspired pieces) whereas the saxophonist is often taking his cues from horn players from the 1930's and also embracing the likes of Albert Ayler as well as funk. Murray sounds like someone from today whereas Wynton seems far more cautious. The point I wanted to make was the you can't really divorce yourself too far from the past as if you go too far you are utlimately too far removed from what jazz is about. If you think of musicians as diverse as Murray, Akinmusire, Keith Jarrett, Vijay Iyer, Bill Frisell, James Carter, John Scofield, Tim Berne, John Hollenbeck, David Binney, Kenny Garrett, etc, they all sound contemporary but still acknowledge the roots of the music. Murray epitomises this.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

thanks for the review Ian and S-A for gig reminiscences i find a similar joy in listening to Joshua Redman as David Murray - on form both can blow to save the universe .... [was that hot jazz we were discussing?]

[Alyn_Shipton]

Ian
Not around to review Murray at present - I am Quebec for the local jazz festival. Hearing new musicians from French speaking Canada. One tenor player worth checking out who played a blistering set last night is Chet Doxas. Also a very interesting band led by bassist Jean-Felix Mailloux. Plus guitarist Ben Charest playing live parts of his score to the animated film "Les Triplettes de Belleville". Excellent high standard of playing, original compositions and new ideas here...
Thanks BTW (on other thread) for hot record suggestions. IMHO can be of any era...

[Ian R Storror]

Hi Forum, I came across this thread while reasearching a David Murray Quartet gig date (year) in Bristol Cathedral

Just a note to say I was the promoter of the Bristol 'Pub' gig with the David Murray Quartet. in May 1992. We were very fortunate to host the great David Murray at The Albert Inn (Jazz at the Albert now known as Jazzata), thanks in large part to Nod Knowles of then, South West Jazz; who asked us to be part of a short week long tour in the UK. This was a period of time when HM Gov were masively cutting Arts Funding (not unusual but particularly brutal in 1992) and the Murray tour was effected by Arts Centres where he had been booked into for the tour, that were pulling out because of the cuts. Nod knew my admiration of Murray's music and as we had helped previously with CMN tours and later for Serious, he got in touch to see if we could incorporate the gig into my programme, which had been going since 1983.

Because so many gigs had dropped out of the tour (they regarded the gig as 'Risky', and now funding cuts caused them to panic) it meant that the number of gigs in the tour was close to effecting the required visa specifications. We stepped in to help.....gladly!
The line-up was:
David Murray (Tenor Sax & Bass Clarinet) USA
Dave Burrell (Piano) USA
Tony Overwater (Bass) Holland
Idris Mohammed (Drums) USA

We only had three weeks notice to put the gig on and had to charge £15 a ticket (more than double our usual prices), the gig sold out in 10 days (capacity officially 70, on this night 100+).
When the band arrived it was clear the band were not too impressed.
After I greeted and settled the band in the upstairs 'Club Room' (dressing room), i spoke with the guys and assured them that the audience were really looking forward to hear them play, we fed them well and they seemed a little more optimistic.

I notice the mention in this Forum; of David 'going through the motions' on some gigs....it was a worry I had, especially after the initial reaction to our tiny venue in a suburb of Bristol.
The place was so packed the band had to enter the stage from behind the bar, to polite applause. The gig started and after a minute or so David rasped into a five minute solo......the place erupted, people were standing on the seats and tables at the back. Murray's reaction was a sly smile and he relaxed to the side to allow the trio to play. The rest of the night was a constant minimum 8/10 on every number, the whole room was into it and so were the band, there was no holding back.

During the interval I checked the guys were happy with everything on stage (sound, hearing each other etc), they were.
I then took a risk; I had been warned by the tour-road manager that David was prone to not doing things he didn't want to do!
My friend Andy Sheppard had arrived (at my request) and I asked David if Andy could 'Sit-in' him for a number in the second set, he said yes! I got the two to meet in the dressing room and all seemed OK.

However, as the second set progressed well, the time was getting on and he hadn't invited Andy to the stage. David announced the next tune would be the last number of the gig, my heart sank as I thought he had decided not to ask Andy, but then he did, saying "I understand there is a sax player in the audience". Andy's arrival was greeted by a massive cheer. We all knew how good Andy was but David had never heard of him. The tune began (i don't remeber the tune, i was sweating too much) and they swapped solos, While Andy was playing David was sat to the side of the stage nodding to Andy's licks and the occassional raised eyebrow. David's reply was mega then they engaged in a back and forth 'call and reply' style which raised the level to +12, the tune went on for 15 minutes after which everybody was in a complete mess of joy and wonder, the band were applauding as well. W were due to finish around 10.30pm it was now 10.50pm.
David Murray called for another tune....asking Andy to stay.

The place erupted again and the level became cosmic, the tune went on for 24 minutes, nobody wanted it to end. Andy had held his own and Murray had upped his level to match, it was a memorable night, which anyone who was there still recalls everytime I meet someone from that night.

Andy and David had a good chat over a pint after everyone had left. I offer some photos of the gig via my Flickr page https://www.flickr.com/photos/jataar...7644079155779/ , genuinely a night to remember.
Cheers
Ian

[Serial_Apologist]

Thanks Ian for sharing your memories of that memorable night in May '92, and putting the record straight on the entry charge to the gig! It's wonderful to have you contributing on the forum - a big welcome!

[Ian Thumwood]

Ian

Thanks again.

It is great to read a professionally written account of what a jazz gig should be about.

I find it intriguing how jazz has moved on since this thread was started back in 2013. Re-reading it, I cannot recall the last time I heard David Murray or read about him in a review. There was a record review on All about jazz that feaured music performed by quartet consisting of Steve Lacy/ Reggie Workman /Mal Waldron and Andrew Cyrille which made me think back to the the 80s and 90s when there was more of an appetite for freer and more aggressive forms of jazz. The whole confrontational element of jazz as described between Murray and Sheppard going head to head does not seem so fashionable these days.

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

That Murray/Sheppard encounter has taken on mythical prepositions! I remember it being talked about amongst Cardiff musicians at the time.

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

He's gone Fu Manchu! Not Chinese chords?
http://www.bristoljazzfestival.co.uk/andy-sheppard/