Knackered politicians

[ardcarp]

Having enjoyed (a) morning tea in bed (b) BAL and (c) a leisurely breakfast, I fall to wondering about the nightmarish stress and fatigue to which politicians have been subjected to over the past 48 hours. OK they're not natural objects of our sympathy, but are days and nights of frenzied activity and complete lack of sleep (not to mention VE day celebrations) really a Good Thing for those who have to make decisions affecting the whole nation? I wonder if any other country packs so much (exit-polls, rapid counts, resigning, visiting palaces, forming coalitions/cabinets, possibly being kicked out of your residence) into so short a space of time? It seems unwise.

[LeMartinPecheur]

Having enjoyed (a) morning tea in bed (b) BAL and (c) a leisurely breakfast, I fall to wondering about the nightmarish stress and fatigue to which politicians have been subjected to over the past 48 hours. OK they're not natural objects of our sympathy, but are days and nights of frenzied activity and complete lack of sleep (not to mention VE day celebrations) really a Good Thing for those who have to make decisions affecting the whole nation? I wonder if any other country packs so much (exit-polls, rapid counts, resigning, visiting palaces, forming coalitions/cabinets, possibly being kicked out of your residence) into so short a space of time? It seems unwise.

We do this because we are efficient and still need to show the rest of the world how to 'do democracy proper' After all, we did invent it and nobody has anything to teach us about it, not even you ardcarp

[mangerton]

.............. democracy proper' After all, we did invent it...........

The Greeks, shurely? Then we nicked it. (Along with the Elgin marbles.)

[visualnickmos]

The Greeks, shurely? Then we nicked it. (Along with the Elgin marbles.)

Exactly what I thought!

[ardcarp]

We do this because we are efficient and still need to show the rest of the world how to 'do democracy proper' After all, we did invent it and nobody has anything to teach us about it, not even you ardcarp

Er....seats in the legislature reflecting the votes cast?

[pastoralguy]

I fall to wondering about the nightmarish stress and fatigue to which politicians have been subjected to over the past 48 hours. .

Don't worry too much. I'm sure their stress and fatigue will 'trickle down' over the next 5 years...

[vinteuil]

VE day celebrations...

... I thought there was something rather wonderful in seeing Messrs Cameron, Miliband, and Clegg performing their ceremonial duties at the cenotaph a couple of hours after the unexpected victory of the one and the defeats of the others; straight faced, stiff-upper-lipped - pure theatre.

The French press can't quite believe - but is much impressed by - the fact that our 'losers' immediately resign. Unimaginable in France (Jospin - a good protestant - being the one famous exception.)

[jean]

The Greeks, shurely?

Only if you think women and slaves don't count.

[french frank]

Only if you think women and slaves don't count.

They didn't then. Now is different.

[jean]

I'm not talking about now.

[vinteuil]

Only if you think women and slaves don't count.

... well - (and I'm sure Mr Grew wd agree here) - the demos was the mob. Of course I'm sexist - but I rate women higher than the mob - even if the Greeks didn't...

[LeMartinPecheur]

The Greeks, shurely? Then we nicked it. (Along with the Elgin marbles.)

All my previous post was meant to be disclaimed by the final

Perhaps I should have said ?

[french frank]

I'm not talking about now.

My point being that you can't transpose the values from one age and impose them retrospectively on another. Yes, the Greeks invented democracy because women and slaves didn't matter (to them). Women do matter now. And in principle slaves matter (to us), though in principle they shouldn't exist at all. But they do exist, and to their masters they still don't matter. That matters (to us) because now is different. I hope that is rather clearer than it evidently was when I first made my comment.

[jean]

But when we say the Greeks invented democracy in the context of what we call democracy, I think it is worth pointing out that the two are hardly the same animal.

[Flosshilde]

Agreed, Jean. A lot of people who say that the (ancient, or classical) Greeks invented democracy probably forget, or don't even realise, that women, slaves, & others weren't included (I'm not including ff in that group). They need reminding. & of course UK democracy didn't include people who din't own land, women, & others unti quite recently.