BaL 6.04.24 - Vaughan Williams: A Sea Symphony

[richardfinegold]

I have always found it to be too long and rather boring . I have Handley, Haitink and the EMI Boult in complete sets. Will give it another try this week.

If RVW had stopped composing after writing it I wonder how many recordings we would have. Many of them exist to make up a set

[Serial_Apologist]

Announcers and reviewers are prone to over-confident (and thoroughly nonsensical) statements of "influence". Like you, I hear no Debussy in Frank Bridge's The Sea at all, beyond the coincidence of title.

As for the Sea Symphony itself, I remember one Gramophone reviewer who blithely cited its "obvious debt" to Daphnis and Chloe. I hope somebody pointed out to that gentleman that the Vaughan Williams symphony was written between 1903 and 1909: much of it predates his "French polish sessions" with Ravel, and the work was first performed two years before the Ravel ballet!

Indeed!

[smittims]

Yes, there are at least two passages in Daphnis that are pure VW and most likely derive from Ravel hearing VW play his music to him during the years of their friendship. Remember that Ravel called VW 'the only pupil who does not write my music'. It was, of course,the other way round.

[Serial_Apologist]

Yes, there are at least two passages in Daphnis that are pure VW and most likely derive from Ravel hearing VW play his music to him during the years of their friendship. Remember that Ravel called VW 'the only pupil who does not write my music'. It was, of course,the other way round.

The modal slow movement of the lovely Piano Trio Ravel composed in 1914 has remarkable harmonic affinities with the Four Hymns for baritone and piano Vaughan Williams would have been composing at around the same time.

[Darloboy]

Previous BaL recommendations:

Michael Kennedy (May 1990): Haitink
Edward Seckerson (May 2000): Haitink + Boult/LPO/Baillie/Cameron as 2nd choice
Piers Burton-Page (May 2007): Atlanta SO/Robert Spano

So The DON will be the first reviewer not to cover this piece in the month of May...

[Wolfram]

Much VW’s worst symphony IMO - no matter who is conducting .

I must confess it’s not my favourite VW symphony either. I have a few recordings on the shelf and the first Boult is the one that manages to hold your attention throughout, much better than the 1970s EMI remake, which is just dull. The sound doesn’t do Isobel Baillie any favours, but John Cameron is by far the best baritone soloist amongst the recordings I own. I had the Previn on LP many years ago and would be interested to hear that one again, if only because I am a big John Shirley-Quirk fan - love everything he did. Robert Spano, the winner last time it was covered on BaL, still stands up reasonably well - great recorded sound, as does the Haitink. However, there have been quite a few additions to the catalogue since then, none of which I have heard, so this could be interesting. But, for the time being, on the rare occasions that I do listen to this work, it is Boult 1 for me.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Try as I might, I just can't 'get to grips' with it, but luckily that doesn't apply to any of the other 8 symphonies, or indeed many of RVW's other works.

I seem to be in a different place from many here. I rank it second place among his symphonies. As for it being overlong, I can’t agree. The texts demand it, and the composer balanced this admirably.
Vaughan Williams had every opportunity to revise the work, as he did with the London Symphony, but chose not to.

[richardfinegold]

I was sorry to see that anyone thinks it too long or boring. I've always been thrilled with every minute of it every time I hear it. For me it's one of the most uplifting pieces of music ever written. But I have disliked many pieces of music by other composers which everyone else seems to love, so I can at least understand the man who said when the chorus sings 'Behold the Sea Itself!' he wanted to shout 'No! You behold it!'

That’s funnier than my impulse to say “Jump in, the waters fine”

[Wolfram]

I seem to be in a different place from many here. I rank it second place among his symphonies. As for it being overlong, I can’t agree. The texts demand it, and the composer balanced this admirably.
Vaughan Williams had every opportunity to revise the work, as he did with the London Symphony, but chose not to.

I think the thing that most irritates me about it is the word setting, which, to my ears, jars quite badly in places. I suppose it all depends upon how much you buy into all that Transcendental spiritual stuff: the sea as a metaphor for infinity; the vastness of the universe and the human spirit…..maybe I don’t dislike it as much as I thought after all.

It certainly doesn’t conduct itself: it really needs a sympathetic, committed performance, such as Boult gave it in 1953. Boult kept it moving forward in 1953. We might be invited to hang about gazing out on the ocean, but the performers shouldn’t.

[smittims]

I was told by an old friend who had once met Vaughan Williams that he had requested Isobel Baillie for the first recording, remembering her wonderfully pure singing in the Serenade to Music. But by 1953 she was getting on in years, and there are a few signs of strain. In the quieter, more expressive passages, however, I still find her outstanding.

I felt much the same aboiut Benita Valente in the Slatkin recording, and wondered if he had asked her to take part for personal reasons.

[oliver sudden]

I rank it second place among his symphonies.

Come on then, you can’t just leave that hanging…

[Pulcinella]

Come on then, you can’t just leave that hanging…

Number 5: mentioned previously.
Mine too, for that matter!
Despite my forum name it jostles for prime position on my desert island!

[oliver sudden]

Number 5: mentioned previously.
Mine too, for that matter!
Despite my forum name it jostles for prime position on my desert island!

Oh yes, now I see it, back in post #12

I think I would have to agree. It took me a while to get into 5. The key turned when VW was CotW and they played the scene of Pilgrim’s Progress whence cometh the material of the Romanza. I have no idea why it should be the case but ever since then that movement has had a direct line to my tear ducts. (And also the climax of the first movement, for which I can’t blame CotW.)

[Barbirollians]

I seem to be in a different place from many here. I rank it second place among his symphonies. As for it being overlong, I can’t agree. The texts demand it, and the composer balanced this admirably.
Vaughan Williams had every opportunity to revise the work, as he did with the London Symphony, but chose not to.

Perhaps he thought it was irremediable ?

[smittims]

I think it was simply that after 1918 he saw the Sea Symphony as belonging to its period with little poiint in trying, or needing, to 'update ' it , as he did with the London Symphony. Also, don't forget that he worked on the Sea Symphony for several years, during which it underwent quite a lot of re-writing before it was performed.