World Routes

[Globaltruth]

Gulls just wanna have fun? (reckon I've been hanging out with JC too long...)

[johncorrigan]

Gulls just wanna have fun? (reckon I've been hanging out with JC too long...)

Not Gullty!

[johncorrigan]

Paul suggested elsewhere that Robin Denslow should get a Wo3 shift - he put in a great report from South Sudan for the last WR on Saturday at a reasonable hour before it's move to the dark hours. Listening to Robin I was thinking he would make very good company for Lopa or Mary Ann for a spot of Charlie's musical ping pong.

The Oumou Sangare session was really terrific - I'll miss WR on a Saturday afternoon says he having listened to it on LA on Sunday afternoon.

[french frank]

I'd forgotten about this thread - so Brighton Gull was quite correct. An inside tip-off? . Still WR won't be on quite as late as Jazz Library.

[Lateralthinking1]

I can live with WR being where it is now on a Sunday. That was Andy's time.

Unless I've missed comments elsewhere, one of the most horrible things hasn't yet been mentioned. Late Junction loses 25% of its time. This is on a par imho with the changes to Breakfast, the new Essential Classics and the movement of Alyn's programme to a ludicrous time. In fact, it is worse from my perspective.

Why is LJ being shortened by half an hour on Tue-Thur? So that TTN can have its full six hours and Breakfast can begin earlier. I doubt that TTN can be altered as it is made elsewhere. However, and I think it would be useful if everyone was entirely clear on this point, we have all lost out to the attempt at making Breakfast appealing to CFM listeners.

There can be much debate about whether the non-classical forms have too much coverage but actually what has been done here should unite us. I wonder if people who loathe the new Breakfast and won't be listening to it would be prepared to argue that it would have been better to have kept LJ at two hours and lopped the 6.30-7am bit off Breakfast instead? Feedback would be most welcome.

I am very happy btw to second or actually third isn't it, JC, the suggestion that Robin gets given a Wo3 shift. I know where people are likely to be going with this argument. However, for now, I would favour a 1-1-1 formula. At the same time, I would give MAK some time on LJ. There are two presenters there who are not completely working for me presently and they are probably not the ones you would immediately think - well, one of the two anyway.

[Footnote - I have placed the points about LJ at # 829 on the Eternal Breakfast Debate thread in Playlist Programmes]

[french frank]

Unless I've missed comments elsewhere, one of the most horrible things hasn't yet been mentioned. Late Junction loses 25% of its time.

Not that it makes a whole lot of difference, but LJ had only been 2 hours long since the beginning of May - when the live concerts were brought back. Prior to that it had been 1hr 45 mins, the same length that it had had from, I think, 2000. Given that Brighton Gull knew about some of these changes in June, my guess is that the longer LJ was only ever a stop-gap until the autumn season began.

That said, it has still lost 15 minutes, on top of the edition it lost in 2007 (3 a week instead of 4).

If you want the explanation - for what an explanation is worth - the strategy in 2000 was to try to bring in new listeners by introducing a wider range of music, including LJ. Now the aim is to bring in new listeners for classical music i.e. to go for the audience which knows nothing about classical music but might be tempted to listen if the content is made easy enough.

That type of planning is frankly just cynical and shows little concern for current listeners - whatever their favourite type of music. I have raised this with the BBC Trust and shall eventually get an answer. Whether they will simply consult management and then declare that they approve of the cunning plan, I really don't know.

[Lateralthinking1]

So that is 2000 - 7 hours, 2007 - 5 hours 45 minutes, (2011 - 6 hours), 2011 - 4 hours 30 minutes. At that rate, it will be down to 3 hours 15 minutes in the next year or two and then 2 hours within a few more months. In other words, a weekly programme.

There are a couple of questions that I know are difficult. 1. Is it better that classical music now has an extra half hour, even if it is of poor quality? 2. Is it better that classical music now has an extra half hour, even if those listening regularly between 0630 and 0700 have a programme of poorer quality to listen to then? I don't expect that those questions will be answered directly and I can understand why but answers would theoretically have a bearing on Late Junction.

Incidentally I think they are aiming too for the CFM people at teatime if the announcers/presenters/hosts (?) are to be Rafferty and Klein. (I know both have been there before). Like Breakfast, it is a catchment time. Get them then and hope that the numbers won't tail off too quickly. Quite what that would mean ultimately for the night I don't know but logically probably Classical lite.

I genuinely do not mean to point score heavily here but I wonder, with hindsight, and indeed with the more recent increase in live concerts in the evenings, whether World Music now looks more benign? At least it has never interfered with the content of classical programmes and could be ring fenced, even if some WM enthusiasts might call that being placed in a ghetto!

[johncorrigan]

Quite what that would mean ultimately for the night I don't know but logically probably Classical lite.

This is the problem Lat - the powers what be don't realise that some folk only listen to commercial channels cos they like the ads - they're not going to switch without a commercial or two - maybe Brightongull could cast some lite on that one.

I have a colleague at work who has Sky TV - they pay fifty quid or something a month for the privelege - she complains about paying for the BBC licence fee. I said 'well if I paid the sky bill I would demand no ads' - she said 'what's wrong with adverts? I love the adverts.' It's a crazy world we're livin' in!!!

[Globaltruth]

Depends on the ad of course..

http://www.edwards.eclipse.co.uk/APeer.mp3

[johncorrigan]

Will Wo3 also be getting a bit lopped off, do we know? - will we notice anyway since it's always getting bits lopped off? .....and that there controller chappy's going to have to pull up his socks - perhaps he should think about getting some of those garters Global.

[Lateralthinking1]

No JC - the weekend schedule is different and Wo3 is on Friday night. This means it will have the same amount of Lopa. I did find your comments in number 23 fascinating and scary. Weird people - and you say you work with them. I'm not sure that I could, nor did I realise that you were one of the remaining rural commuters. As for Sky in Scotland, surely not.

[johncorrigan]

I'm not sure that I could, nor did I realise that you were one of the remaining rural commuters.

In a rural area you end up knowing a wide range of people with a wide range of beliefs, Lat - it's a bit like a non-virtual platform 3 - I'm even on first name terms with the guy who's running for the leader of the Scottish Tories on the 'I'll disband the party and call it something else' platform - I usually become a BBC defender when I'm talking to him - I suggested to him lately that if he wants Scotland to continue with the Union he needs to get behind the great things about Britain like the NHS and the Beeb. He looked incredulous at the thought.
On the Sky issue there are plenty of areas around where Satellite is the only way of receiving anything - but it still bemuses me that these subscribing types pay for Sky and accept Ads as part of the deal - you wouldn't catch spotty doing that.

Thanks for the Wo3 info by the way. Will we lose the first half hour of LJ or the last half hour?

[Globaltruth]

How would you react if the WM output on r3 was doubled overnight but all programming was sponsored? No ads but a plug like
'world on 3 brought to you by Tiger Beer'

Just asking...

[Lateralthinking1]

Interesting question. I wobbled ever so slightly but I would say no on the BBC. How reassuring to find again within seconds my characteristic entrenchment.

JC, we lose the last half hour so it could be worse.

[johncorrigan]

How would you react if the WM output on r3 was doubled overnight but all programming was sponsored? No ads but a plug like
'world on 3 brought to you by Tiger Beer'

Just asking...

....or brought to you by Big Max, G? Thin end of the wedge so I'd join Lat in his trench, though I might not do much digging. Also Lat, I think you're right, losing the last half hour is better than losing the first half hour - I mean doesn't everyone want more Petroc?